• Tisharneth
    Member

    I have 502 ilvl, I have apparently the correct reforging (via noxxic and mrrobot), enchants and gems… I follow the rotations supplied as much as I can
    I’m getting roughly 70k dps instead of the 110 k noxxic says I should be getting (in “realistic” dps, not “maximized”). So I’m off by a good 40k dps somehow, somewhere. I can’t figure this out, can someone please tell me if they had this happen and what they did to fix it? I’m embarrassed by being beaten consistently by worse-geared raiders. I’ve researched sites over and over and I can’t figure out what I’m doing wrong. It must be something huge to miss the mark by over 40k.
    on armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/blackhand/Flitte/simple

    OscarguydudeOscarguydude
    Member

    Try playing survival. Its not you, its the Spec. But if you like BM then stick with it.

    Sometimes Noxxic and Mr.robot are wrong, try to get more Agility and Crit and make sure you have capped Hit/Expertise/Mastery. Your gear is well, but sometimes you need to follow your Instincts then a website.

    Thargen
    Member

    I looked at your armory, and it looks to be about right. I don’t think the answer lies there. You are hit/exp capped and the rest seems fine. Are you getting low DPS in all fights? Beast Mastery excels on single target fights like Jin’rok, but not so much on AoE fights like Horridon, where Survival is king. You also didn’t make mention to your opener, which can have a huge impact throughout the fight, with regard to how your CD’s line up. I started using Rogerbrown’s opener, and it has made a big impact on my overall DPS. If you haven’t already, give it a read here:

    http://www.methodwow.com/board/showthread.php?11376-MoP-Hunter-Guide

    Hope this helps,
    Thargen Eitrigg-US

    reckosheh
    Member

    hello there, I am really happy that I found someone that is actually interested in playing bm hunter’s as it is imo the best single target spec available for hunters in 5.2 ( maybe it will be the best in 5.3 who knows :P).. first of all your reforging is wrong go full haste.. anything that you can add to haste convert it to haste also change your gems put it agi and haste. second of all I have seen that you have 4 set, I recommend using this oppener and rotation as I found it is the most useful and the most efficient ( not 100% stick to the normal rotation in the other sites)…
    1- pre-pot + precast cobra shot so you can get your first thunder hawk (2 set bonus).
    2- use a macro and combine rapid fire with stampede along with rapid.
    3- a macro that include both dire beast + Bestial wrath.
    4- kill command.
    5- murder of crows.
    6- glaive toss.
    7- SPAM arcane shotS until kill command comes off cd ( YOU WILL HAVE THE FOCUS FOR IT IF NOT 120 ALREADY).
    8- kill command as soon as it comes back.
    9- macro readiness+kill command.
    10- glaive toss.
    11- by now your first bestial wrath duration has ended cast the same macro again in step 3.
    12- SPAM ARCANE SHOTS.
    13- cast rapid fire as soon as buff wears off.
    14- try to keep your eyes in your focus so you can immediately cast another Murder of crows after the duration of the first one finishes.
    15- pretty much normal rotation where you keep everything on cd.
    note: whenever you cast dire beast + bestial wrath (when it comes off cd) SPAAAAAM ARCANE SHOTS AND NEVER EVER CAST COBRA SHOTS WHILE YOU ARE UNDER BESTIAL WRATH even if the serpent sting will fall off, wait tell bestial wrath wears off and cast serpent sting again.
    16- imo a good bm hunter should never ever run out of something he do in the fight.. aka even if everything on cd.. use arcane shots and cobra shots continuously and of course keep your eye on ur focus you want to have 40 focus so you can cast kill command without any any any any delay (even 0.1 sec is a loss of dps).. finally go check this guy on youtube.. kriparrian he has an amazing macro guide to bm hunters in 5.0-5.1 patch which is still viable tell now ..although he quit playing wow recently.. cheers and gl let me know if this helps..
    edit.. in your opener dont cast cobra shot at all if the serpent sting fall off then re apply it again manualy..

    OscarguydudeOscarguydude
    Member

    Going full haste though, also has its downfalls. If you go “FULL ON” haste. you’re DPS will drop trust me.

    Dreamerra
    Member

    I agree with Oscarguydude because I am BM I have every thing caped I need to change to survival sorry but Bm might be good for a dungeons or questing but not raids. My Bm has only been doing 80k to 60k it makes use Bm like o I have good gear good health but my Dps is like low. I also have 502 gear almost getting more gear. so listen to Oscarguydude he knows what he talking about.

    Dreamerra
    Member

    DO you have any advice for a rotation for survival because I dont know cause I have been going by this site don’t know if its right i have a friend that is a hunter also uses survival but wow changed everything on us.

    OscarguydudeOscarguydude
    Member

    @Dreamerra – I sure will give you rotation: Serpent Sting, Black Arrow, Explosive Shot, Arcane Shot, Repeat. Just make sure you keep your Serpent Sting, Explosive Shot, and Black Arrow up on you’re opponent/Mob and you will be good! :)

    Zirke
    Member

    @Dreamerra — If you think BM is only good for dungeons and quests then you are wrong. I am 493 iLvl and I pull around 90-100k in Raids with BM.

    Fanaerus
    Member

    Overall my question would is your raid team upset/disappointed with where you’re at? Its ok if you are, there are so many ways to play our beloved class. I play this class on a couple of realms, Wrymrest Accord and Icecrown. Icecrown is where the WHU guild is and there are always discussion like this one. Hunter’s talking about haste builds, hitting your caps, etc. I can’t say which is better, only that to try them out and see what works for you. I play SV and have had very few BM specs out do my dps, LFR being the exception. I hit my caps and go from there, tweak as I go, I prefer a high crit, (I really loved the old Armor pen builds in WotLK). Check out warcraft hunter’s union lots of great class info and links to other great hunter blogs.

    poisonfang
    Member

    reckosheh wrote:
    hello there, I am really happy that I found someone that is actually interested in playing bm hunter’s as it is imo the best single target spec available for hunters in 5.2 ( maybe it will be the best in 5.3 who knows :P)..

    is it…. Or is it MM?

    GoldSenpaiGoldSenpai
    Member

    @Zirke — My mom(yes my mom) usually pulls top 5 as BM hunter in BG’s and does quite well in arenas…she does better than me….given im a raider but still… lol

    GoldSenpaiGoldSenpai
    Member

    @Tisharneth — I haven’t checked the Noxxic guide for Hunters but i usually follow the following stat priorities:
    1. Agility
    2. Hit Rating and Expertise Rating (till cap)
    3. Critical Strike Rating
    4. Haste Rating
    5. Mastery Rating

    Although i hold Critical Strike Rating, Haste Rating, and Mastery Rating are all very close to each other in value.

    Gulldar
    Member

    @Dreamerra — Not quite sure what you guys are doing wrong that you think BM is no good in raids, I run BM on every fight except Horridon, (hands down Surv is best for this fight). I’m run 120K dps with a 515 gear score and only a 2 piece set, my partner is running Surv with 4 piece set at a 530+ gear score and hitting 140K avg. Dreamerra has the rotation pretty spot on but the reforge I’m not sure about. I run almost equal crit and haste and crit being the higher side, I noticed that with more haste my DPS dropped dramatically and as I brought crit in closer to haste and past is where I my best DPS was. It could be play style as well. It was all about tweeking and testing. Try using the test dummy without CDs, just straight rotation and tweek some reforge or gems to see where the DPS goes with that.

    Postman024
    Member

    What everyone fails to even mention here, and what puts this debate completely to rest, is that Haste did not become the dominant, or even the better, secondary stat until the RPPM (Real Proc per Minute) system came in to play in 5.3. The problem was that only 4 trinkets (Shado-Pan Talisman, Talisman of Bloodlust, Bad JuJu #2, and Renatakki’s #1, actually utilize this new proc per minute system. Crit was the way to go until you had two RPPM pieces or more. This could include any of the four trinket I mentioned, and the Legendary Quest Chain Meta, or the 2 and 4 piece sets of gear. The problem was that the 2 and 4 piece set was a very slight DPS increase with more haste, so it left half the Hunters in the world not seeing the benefit of haste, because the increase only made it better about half the time. If you did actually have, say, Renatakki’s and Bad JuJu, there is not doubt in my mind you would find going full blown haste to be more effective. Especially if you have the 2-piece, and expenentially better if you had the Legendary Meta. The weapon damage changes also added to this, which is why every website mentions the significant difference between ToT weapons and ToES Sha Touched Weapons. Even with a significantly agility numbers when adding the Sha Touched Gem, they could not out perform the Weapon Damage numbers, due to these changes. The fact is, Crit was king, till Haste came in with RPPM, A.K.A. PED’s (Performance Enhancing Drugs), making little guys like Barry Bonds turn into monsters by simply changing Crit over to Haste before people started catching on. Obviously there is still quote a bit of confusion out there. If the bat goes faster, the ball goes farther, to put it as simply as possible because I really do not feel like laying out the RPPM math that proves this.

    Postman024
    Member

    I have 502 ilvl, I have apparently the correct reforging (via noxxic and mrrobot), enchants and gems… I follow the rotations supplied as much as I can
    I’m getting roughly 70k dps instead of the 110 k noxxic says I should be getting (in “realistic” dps, not “maximized”). So I’m off by a good 40k dps somehow, somewhere. I can’t figure this out, can someone please tell me if they had this happen and what they did to fix it? I’m embarrassed by being beaten consistently by worse-geared raiders. I’ve researched sites over and over and I can’t figure out what I’m doing wrong. It must be something huge to miss the mark by over 40k.
    on armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/blackhand/Flitte/simple

    To add to your initial inquiry, GM and Survival have gone back and forth since the expansion was released. Do what you feel is most comfortable and enjoyable, while not being a detriment to your raid group. A true raider will always play the spec that yields the most numbers for them personally, until they can figure out what they are doing wrong in the spec that is testing as the best. You will eventually see that BM an SV are essentially the same rotation with different methods of using CD’s and different procs. Learning when and how to use a abilties with procs that maximize numbers, but most importantly, why to use them in that fashion, is what gets you to the top of your raid’s charts.

    What bothers me is that classes like Pally’s of late, and Druid’s to be in 5.4, are OP in most, of not all specs (Druids will be OP in all four specs on 5.4 while Pally’s were OP in all three of theirs on 5.2 and 5.3) while we Hunters, have only one role option, with three specs to cbose from, and none are in the top 10 until you factor in mechanics. Even them, not one cracks the top 5. I guess only the Mage community can really pic any of their three DPS specs and will be better than any other class, and only outdonr by their own class in a different spec. But that i a whole new topic and I apologize for bringing it up. Just had to get it off my chest. =)

    corkmancorkman
    Member

    some classes have ‘breakpoints’ for haste that add another tick onto a dot or hot, does hunter have a breakpoint for an extra tick on serpent sting or black arrow or explosive shot/trap? i just don’t see a haste build since the only thing i shoot that has cast time is cobra

    Hiccups
    Member

    <div class=”d4p-bbp-quote-title”>corkman wrote:</div>
    some classes have ‘breakpoints’ for haste that add another tick onto a dot or hot, does hunter have a breakpoint for an extra tick on serpent sting or black arrow or explosive shot/trap? i just don’t see a haste build since the only thing i shoot that has cast time is cobra

    Haste does not add extra ticks to hunter DoTs. Now that Blizzard has changed RPPM trinkets to not have an increased proc rate due to haste, there is no point to reforge or gem into it over crit.

    poachingbear
    Member

    Old thread, but let me tell you this Tish, regardless of what ANYONE has said, BM is amazing in Single Target AND Aoe fights for DPS. Your single target more than makes up for a shammy padding meters with Chain Lightning and still not holding his DPS higher than yours. Heres a little help tho as of 5.4

    Ive raided BM ( Poachingbear – US Eredar ) Since Cata as my main, and i’ve never seen terrible dps. Im currently 553 doing an average of 230-260k with my legendary cloak, on any given fight. Couple tips: Take Murder of crows. IDC what any other hunter thinks, MoC is OP and should be used. Second tip is to take concussive shot out of your rotation, why its there is beyond me. Rotation: Hunters Mark > Pot > Rapid Fire > Cobra shot > Serpent Sting > Beastial Wrath > Kill Command > Murder of Crows > Stampede > Kill Command > Glaive Toss > Cobra shot > Arcane shot x 4 ( depending on haste, but Rapid fire should be up and able to save your focus > Kill command > Dire Beast > And then Follow rotation of using Beastial wrath of CD, Rapid fire, Kill command blah blah blah. My B-Tag is Poachinbro1#1957 and if ANY hunter seeing this needs help, please add me. I’m going to sound vain but seriously I am one of the best hunters I’ve ever seen. Almost topping hunters with 10+ ilvl on me. Also, i use A spirit beast ( cat – Ankha ) for personal heals, in the ferocity tree

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